"Champions Forever" may be the best boxing documentary of all time. Exquisitely done, it features the five greatest heavyweight boxers of the 1960's and 1970's. The story focuses primarily on M. Ali, beginning with his huge upset victory over the sullen and powerfully intimidating Sonny Liston, and then proceeds to document the rise of Joe Frazier, George Foreman, Kenny Norton, and finally Larry Holmes. While the story seems to revolve around the rise and eventual fall of M. Ali, the other four greats are featured in their biggest fights as well. There are interviews with all five men, and they bring timely commentary to their lives and fights that is both enlightening and informative.
In the heavyweight division, there was no greater period than that of the 60's, 70's, and 80's. These five fighters ruled the heavyweight division during this time, and their fights with each other are now considered classics nin fisticuffs. In watching the documentary, Foreman comes off as the most well-rounded of the five. He shows candor (admitting his knees were shaking when he met Frazier for the first time!), humility (praising the other fighters frequently), and a terrific sense of humor (he has a 1,000-watt smile). The bad blood that Frazier still carries for Ali is clearly evident in his interviews. Frazier believes that Ali verbally taunted and abused him unnecessarily in the build-up to their three intense fights. While Ali says he was only trying to build the gate and create excitement for the fight, (as he did for all his fights), Frazier took the verbal darts personally and it is obvious that Ali's words hurt the intense pride of Joe Frazier. In fact, Frazier is so torn on this that he actually expresses a macabre sense of satisfaction that his powerful punches may have caused Ali's Parkinson's Syndrome. Frazier comes across as a bitter and "small" man based on his comments about Ali. Ali's comments are painful to watch, as he is obviously suffering from the Parkinson's affliction and has little expression and haltering speech. Larry Holmes clearly suffers being in the shadow of the great Ali, and he is somewhat bitter like Frazier, not so much towards Ali, but towards boxing in general, as contemporary boxing did not recognize his greatness at the time. Kenny Norton was champion by default, being "awarded" the title by boxing associations when Ali first retired, and his inclusion is this group may be somewhat questionable. I do not mean to take anything away from Norton, as he gave Ali and Holmes fights that were wars. However, Norton was easily beat by Foreman, while he and Frazier never battled. (I suspect Frazier's powerful shots would have stopped Norton, who was not a KO specialist). Norton's inclusion in this group is clearly due to his three epic battles with the great Ali. Norton's awkward style gave Ali fits and Ali could not dominate Norton with his jab and speed as he did others. Boxing enthusiasts believe Norton won 2 of 3 of their fights, the last fight being "awarded" to the clearly aging Ali based mor on his legend than his ability.
While this is the best boxing film I have ever viewed, I would have loved to have seen two other boxers included, those being Sonny Liston and Mike Tyson. The inclusion of these two men would have summed up the years 1960 - 1990. Obviously, Liston was dead long before this film was made (1989), and Tyson was the current heavyweight champion in 1989. If the film is ever remade (doubtful), it would nice for the sake of completeness to have the life stories of both Tyson and Liston included.
If you were alive during the 70's and want to relive the excitment of that period of boxing, there is no better film to watch than this one. If you are a younger boxing fan and have heard about the great fighters of the 70's, this is the film to watch to learn about these greats. There is simply no better documentary of that period than this one.
HIGHLY recommended.
Jim "Konedog" Koenig, (Boxing Fan and Fight-Film Collector) |
I thought this was a great documentary. They do show Ali alot, but it's not really because their being unfair, it's just that he was the best of the 5 and was so much more of a figure then the rest. However, it was unfair that they cut off Holmes' reign. They start off in the early 60s with Cassius Clay pummeling Sonny Liston, ignoring the fact that the Ali-Frazier-Foreman-Norton-Holmes fights didn't begin until the 70's, yet when the Ali-Frazier-Foreman-Norton-Holmes fights end with Holmes beating Norton, the documentary ends rather then going into Larry's achievements. Yes Ali was the best, yes Ali would have beaten Holmes, yes Ali's career in the 60's was very profound because of the Vietnam controversy, but give Larry some justice.
I agree with a previous Poster that these fights are a little to chopped up, but it's still interesting to see. Had they added an hour of fight footage to this film this would get 5 stars on everyone's list and would be considered one of the best sports documentaries of all time.
As mentioned, this documentary revolves around Ali. It shows clips of his domination of boxing in the 60's, then make's some statements about the Vietnam controversy, and give's the other 4 guys opinions on Ali's decision not to enter the service. Smokin' Joe Frazier is the only one who disagrees with Ali not going, and Frazier make's it clear that he feel's that not only is Ali insane, but Frazier feels that during their 3 fights Ali was someone who was not trying to get attention for the fights, not someone who was trying to get big purses and big gates for the fights, but that Ali was simply trying to personaly hurt Frazier. Ali make's an apology to Frazier at the end, but to this day I think they are just two guy's who wont get along.
It goes into Frazier and his fights with Quarry and Ellis, then it goes into Ali-Frazier I and Frazier's victory over Ali. Then we go into Big George Foreman, his Olympic Days, and his obliteration of Frazier and Norton. What is interesting is that when you see Ali-Foreman, the Rumble in the Jungle, without seeing the Frazier-Norton Foreman fights, you kind of wonder why everyone thinks Ali is going to lose. The Rumble in the Jungle looks like a blow out, Ali destroying Foreman. But by seeing the way that Foreman hits Frazier and Norton, and the way they just suddenly collapse, then look at the way that Foreman was hitting Ali, you can see how the 70s spectators might have figured "Ali's in trouble."
Before the Rumble in the Jungle in Zaire, we see Ali-Norton I in California. Norton breaks Ali's jaw and wins the fight. Ali won the rematch, but they dont show the rematch in this film. They do however show Ali's victory over Frazier in their rematch.
Then we see Zaire, where Ali add's insult to injury to the Boxing Commissions, Conservatives, and Hard Hats of the Vietnam period by knocking out George Foreman and regaining his title. They took his title, kicked him out, tried to send him to jail, he got back in, didn't go to jail, and got his title back. That, my friends, is revenge.
Then we see the Thrilla in Manila, which along with Hagler-Hearns is thought to be the most savage fight in boxing history.
We then see a bald Joe Frazier once again get creamed by George Foreman, who then retired because of a loss to Jimmy Young and a decision to become a minister. Big George later regained the title by knocking Michael Moorer's head off, but this documentary was made before that.
Then we see the Rubber Match between Ali and Norton. Many people feel that Norton won, but if you look at the fight, you see Norton standing, Ali jabbing, then finally when there's 2 seconds left in the round, Norton charges at Ali, throws some bombs, which Ali blocks. Similar to the first Roy Jones Jr.-Antonio Tarver fight, Jones keeps hitting Tarver, Tarver stands still, then with 2 seconds left in the round Tarver gets Jones on the ropes and throws bombs, but Tarver still loses, as did Norton. Ali also should have retired after Manila, so that, plus the fact that Ali never had an easy time with Norton, explains Ali's lackluster performance, though he still won.
Then we see the Ali-Spinks fights, Ali becoming three time champion.
It then goes into Larry Holmes beating Ken Norton in their barn burner battle, but we dont see any of Holmes' later title defenses besides his fight with Ali where Ali is simply to old and to sickly to fight anymore. We do see Holmes losing to Tyson in what I consider to be one of the ugliest KO's of the past 20 years, during the begining of the documentary. It's bad enough they didn't show the rest of Holmes' career, his wins over Shavers and Cooney and other Title Defenses, they didn't have to add to it by showing him getting obliterated by Iron Mike. Holmes lost to Tyson the way Ali lost to Holmes, Holmes was getting old and at that point he shouldn't have been in the same ring with Tyson.
I thought this documentary was very good. This was the greatest period in Heavyweight History, and Ali beat all these guys, except Holmes. Without a doubt a 25 year old Ali would beat a 25 year old Holmes, but when their actual fight took place we have Holmes in his 20s against a 38 year old Parkinsonian Ali. We do see Ali landing some good jabs on Holmes early in the fight, so in my opinion that dispels the myth that Holmes had a better jab. Holmes was great, but he was like a downgraded version of Ali, anything Holmes can do Ali can do better. Ali's prime ended in 1967, Ali fought Holmes in 1980.
The fights that never happened between these guy's were Norton-Frazier, Holmes-Frazier, Holmes-Foreman, which would have all been battles. I think Frazier blows Norton away because Norton cant take a punch, I think Holmes can beat Frazier by decision but it would not be easy, and I think Holmes probably beat's Foreman by decision, maybe. Holmes has said that he feel's that George Foreman has been ducking him for 3 decades, he still want's to fight Foreman even at this point, though I doubt it will ever happen, and with their age it probably shouldn't.
Good documentary, but don't think of this simply as a tribute to Ali and his victims, it does a decent job with all of them and tries to treat them all as Champions, you can't blame Ali for beating everyone. |
| A Very Uncomfortable Dinner But Great Fights Great DVD - 4.25 Stars This is difficult to review - some of the greatest scenes I've ever seen and some of the hardest scenes I've ever seen. Here's what's hard- watching what's happened to Muhammad. It's just difficult and sad. He's still the Greatest and still likes to clown, but you just can't help but wonder why or what if...
What's also painful is watching the dinner with these great champions. It's good and bad, but mostly just really uncomfortable. On to the good. I've never seen so much great fight footage on one DVD. You don't get entire fights, but get the highlights. It's absolutely amazing and worth getting the DVD (or VHS) for this only - everything else is gravy. An absolute must have for any boxing fan.
A great item for any Ali fan - there's actually one moment where Ali talks about coming back and taking on Tyson - and I found myself excited and actually thinking how great that would be...and then waking up to the reality and silently laughing at myself. If you're a George Foreman fan I think you'll want this as well. George comes across as not only a great champion, but a humble and incredible man as well. |
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"Champions Forever: World Heavyweight Champs! "
"World HW Champs"
"A Very Uncomfortable Dinner But Great Fights"